Jestersix

Ack! I think I have flatworms?! And a tiny tank centipede.

[quote author=Mr. Ugly link=topic=6377.msg81534#msg81534 date=1234720692]
Per Calfo on WWM:

your critter is a flatworm/AKA Planaria... and is actually of the harmless variety. This creature preys on copepods and is common to flare in young tanks when the copepod population is strong (yay!) before the tank is overstocked (booo...) or stocked too quickly (too common). They will wane when the copepods do. No worries. Best regards Anthony
Click to expand...

The pic in that answer shows a clear-ish planaria though.

Haven't read that much about what they eat, but ran across a random reference or two.

Overfeeding any food could contribute to increase in planaria population. Not specific to RN products, folks.
[/quote]

Well that helps confirm that I've been overfeeding . :(

It is also interesting about the flatworms eating copepods... there are just sooooo many species out there with soooo many different habits. It is what makes nature incredibly fascinating to me. :D

And pixi was probably right in believing that the flatworms didn't all come from the Montipora. Perhaps just a coincidence that I happen to see the outbreak after adding the new corals. Tricky! ;D
 
Over feeding isn't the only reason for a large copepod population and I strive for a large population as do others :) And like I said, I have swarms of copepods, mysids, amphipods and isopods and red planaria have never taken hold in mys system. I way over feed and I under skim :) I remember one thing that does add to them exploding in population, salinity. Lower then reef (1.026) salinity seems to help them thrive. I've always tried to keep my salinity at 1.025 or above so that may be one reason why I don't seem to get them. I have plenty of the clear ones though, which do feed on copepods, diatoms, bacteria, etc. I think Anthony is incorrect, but I have an email to a scientist that studies marine worms and the likes so hopefully she'll shed some light on this. Every reference I can find in books don't say they do but rather rely on light and *phytoplankton* especially two of the 5 in Phyto-Feast :(
 
[quote author=Mr. Ugly link=topic=6377.msg81534#msg81534 date=1234720692]
Per Calfo on WWM:

your critter is a flatworm/AKA Planaria... and is actually of the harmless variety. This creature preys on copepods and is common to flare in young tanks when the copepod population is strong (yay!) before the tank is overstocked (booo...) or stocked too quickly (too common). They will wane when the copepods do. No worries. Best regards Anthony
Click to expand...

The pic in that answer shows a clear-ish planaria though.

Haven't read that much about what they eat, but ran across a random reference or two.

Overfeeding any food could contribute to increase in planaria population. Not specific to RN products, folks.
[/quote]

Clear one do eat copepods (amongst other things), I've watched that happen numerous times :) (wish I had it on film)
 
Salinity?

Going to check...

Salinity is 1.026

I always learn something new on BAR :) I didn't know that salinity affects flatworm populations, nor that some species of flatworms eat copepods. Active learning is supposed to stay dementia right? ;D Another great excuse to be part of BAR and reef keeping! ;D
 
You can use hyposalinity to nuke planaria. Other reef stuff may not like it though :D

Here's some planaria info. Couple knowledgeable folks posted there.

http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=102683

Friends of yours, Gresh?

Quite a while back when I was trying to hatch and raise frogfishes, Gresh got me the hookup on rotifer and pod cultures.

Read a little bit about food culturing. There was one mention about finding pods underneath decaying driftwood.

So don't put rotted logs in your tank :D
 
Thanks for the reference Norm. :)

It's everything I've ever wanted to know about Convolutrilobids. ;D I even read (the pertinant parts) of the Zootaxa article.

It's too bad temp. won't work -must be under 61 or over 93. Decreased light won't work - dark for 30-35 days. :(

So aside from outright poisoning them with flatworm exit; as you mentioned above, hyposalinity might be effective for bringing down the population numbers. How long do you think clams and sps and some softies could tolerate salinity lowered to 1.022? (25% mortality) How about 1.017 or 8? (50% mortality) The article suggested 3 days. Could the clams and corals handle this length of time at those specific gravities?

Perhaps lowered salinity coupled with lower nutrient levels will wipe them out. The site said that depriving them of food would take 1-2 years to get rid of them, but then I'd have to starve my clam and corals too. :( Maybe I'll have to put them on a diet. :)
 
Gresham, do you think the flatworms will eat tigerpods? The article Norm referenced said that the flatworms were fed brine shrimp nauplii. The tigerpods are about the same size and color as the brine babies.
 
Lyn, a few months back I had the exact same problem. They came in on my xenia (then ate it) and then they just slowly disappeared. My salinity was stable at 1.022-1.023 (because I though it was supposed to be at that anyways) and I did a water change every weekend of about 1/3 of the tank's water. The xenia that they were mainly eating was not near any other softies so they never spread around the tank. So what I'm basically saying is to slowly (over a period of about 2 weeks) lower the salinity to 1.022 (it won't even effect the corals)
and do water changes of 1/2 of the tank's water every week or so. Move the coral that have flatworms away from other softies or corals that might be able to get them. The flat worms MIGHT eventually end up eating what every they are on, and if there is nothing else around that area for them to eat, they will eventually die off. If the thing the flatworms are eating dies or is starting to, take it out of the tank, scrape the flatworms off with something sharp, and place the object they had been eating back in the tank. Repeat that until there are none left that you can get off/see. That is how I got rid of mine. And also, I had no clue what they were at the time, but after a month or two I realized and since the xenia they had been eating was melting down, I just pulled it out of the water and scraped off all the flatworms. I wasn't doing the water changes because of them, but I just needed to do a water change. Hope some of the info I gave helps!
:)
 
[quote author=Lyn link=topic=6377.msg81643#msg81643 date=1234749344]
Gresham, do you think the flatworms will eat tigerpods? The article Norm referenced said that the flatworms were fed brine shrimp nauplii. The tigerpods are about the same size and color as the brine babies.
[/quote]
Only benthic copepidites, not pelagic adults.

Norm, yup, that's her. I forgot about Tom :D
 
And the tank "centipede" sounds sort of like a bristle worm, but you have probably seen a bristle worm before right? I have a book that shows different marine life that can develop in a tank, and I think I found what you described...

It might be...
Crab larvae (if you have crabs in your tank)
Some type of pod
Shrimp larvae

or, it might be a sea cucumber thing. If you started the tank with live sand, there might have been some microscopic life forms in it that grew into sea creatures. Sometimes that will happen after about a year or two.
 
[quote author=Euphyllia link=topic=6377.msg81666#msg81666 date=1234754520]
Lyn, a few months back I had the exact same problem. They came in on my xenia (then ate it) and then they just slowly disappeared. My salinity was stable at 1.022-1.023 (because I though it was supposed to be at that anyways) and I did a water change every weekend of about 1/3 of the tank's water. The xenia that they were mainly eating was not near any other softies so they never spread around the tank. So what I'm basically saying is to slowly (over a period of about 2 weeks) lower the salinity to 1.022 (it won't even effect the corals)
and do water changes of 1/2 of the tank's water every week or so. Move the coral that have flatworms away from other softies or corals that might be able to get them. The flat worms MIGHT eventually end up eating what every they are on, and if there is nothing else around that area for them to eat, they will eventually die off. If the thing the flatworms are eating dies or is starting to, take it out of the tank, scrape the flatworms off with something sharp, and place the object they had been eating back in the tank. Repeat that until there are none left that you can get off/see. That is how I got rid of mine. And also, I had no clue what they were at the time, but after a month or two I realized and since the xenia they had been eating was melting down, I just pulled it out of the water and scraped off all the flatworms. I wasn't doing the water changes because of them, but I just needed to do a water change. Hope some of the info I gave helps!
:)
[/quote]

You say they, as in red planaria, were eating your xenia? Another new one on me. Even Tom's articles states they don't eat coral :)
 
[quote author=Euphyllia link=topic=6377.msg81669#msg81669 date=1234755213]
And the tank "centipede" sounds sort of like a bristle worm, but you have probably seen a bristle worm before right? I have a book that shows different marine life that can develop in a tank, and I think I found what you described...

It might be...
Crab larvae (if you have crabs in your tank)
Some type of pod
Shrimp larvae

or, it might be a sea cucumber thing. If you started the tank with live sand, there might have been some microscopic life forms in it that grew into sea creatures. Sometimes that will happen after about a year or two.

[/quote]

It's an isopod most likely :)

safe_isopod.jpg
 
[quote author=Euphyllia link=topic=6377.msg81666#msg81666 date=1234754520]
Lyn, a few months back I had the exact same problem. They came in on my xenia (then ate it) and then they just slowly disappeared. My salinity was stable at 1.022-1.023 (because I though it was supposed to be at that anyways) and I did a water change every weekend of about 1/3 of the tank's water. The xenia that they were mainly eating was not near any other softies so they never spread around the tank. So what I'm basically saying is to slowly (over a period of about 2 weeks) lower the salinity to 1.022 (it won't even effect the corals)
and do water changes of 1/2 of the tank's water every week or so. Move the coral that have flatworms away from other softies or corals that might be able to get them. The flat worms MIGHT eventually end up eating what every they are on, and if there is nothing else around that area for them to eat, they will eventually die off. If the thing the flatworms are eating dies or is starting to, take it out of the tank, scrape the flatworms off with something sharp, and place the object they had been eating back in the tank. Repeat that until there are none left that you can get off/see. That is how I got rid of mine. And also, I had no clue what they were at the time, but after a month or two I realized and since the xenia they had been eating was melting down, I just pulled it out of the water and scraped off all the flatworms. I wasn't doing the water changes because of them, but I just needed to do a water change. Hope some of the info I gave helps!
:)
[/quote]

I don't think flatworms eat Xenia. The Xenia could have been melting because of water conditions. They are known to be finicky. Flatworms will go all over your tank, not stay in one spot. I really hope you don't have something more sinister lurking in your tank. Take a good look to make sure you don't have those small critters you had before. However, if you really did have flatworms, then perhaps your lower salinity did decrease their population, especially if you had it low for a really long time.

Thanks for trying to help. I appreciate it. :)
 
[quote author=GreshamH link=topic=6377.msg81671#msg81671 date=1234755303]
[quote author=Euphyllia link=topic=6377.msg81669#msg81669 date=1234755213]
And the tank "centipede" sounds sort of like a bristle worm, but you have probably seen a bristle worm before right? I have a book that shows different marine life that can develop in a tank, and I think I found what you described...

It might be...
Crab larvae (if you have crabs in your tank)
Some type of pod
Shrimp larvae

or, it might be a sea cucumber thing. If you started the tank with live sand, there might have been some microscopic life forms in it that grew into sea creatures. Sometimes that will happen after about a year or two.

[/quote]

It's an isopod most likely :)

safe_isopod.jpg

[/quote]

BINGO! Glad they are harmless. Have you ever seen them with their long "tails". Is it a fishing pole-like appendage? Only some have it, the pictured one doesn't have it.
 
So that is what you meant by "centipede"! :eek:
I though those were pods when I saw them in my tank. I have about 25 or so in my 14.
Do you guys know where or even if they sell live pods?
 
I searched "Isopod Picture" and I found an illustration with the tail thing you are talking about. Tell me if that is it. The second picture I found scared the heck out of me so I decided to post it too! :)
 
[quote author=Euphyllia link=topic=6377.msg81679#msg81679 date=1234756716]
So that is what you meant by "centipede"! :eek:
I though those were pods when I saw them in my tank. I have about 25 or so in my 14.
Do you guys know where or even if they sell live pods?
[/quote]

Yup, they are isopods. I was referring to the multiple sets of legs like centipedes have. :D

[quote author=Euphyllia link=topic=6377.msg81680#msg81680 date=1234756977]
I searched "Isopod Picture" and I found an illustration with the tail thing you are talking about. Tell me if that is it. The second picture I found scared the heck out of me so I decided to post it too! :)
[/quote]
Yes, the first drawing of the long "tail-like" appendage looks right. :) Good job finding it. :D
 
I recently noticed a red planaria infestation in my tank. Did a lot of reading online, and learned that freshwater dips can be quite effective. I removed the worst rocks from the tank, dipped them in dechlorinated tapwater (appropriate temperature) for a few minutes, and shook off the dead flatworms. The population has definitely diminished, although the remaining flatworms seem to have moved to other rocks. Given your nano tank, this might be an effective solution.
 
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