Reef nutrition

Interesting post from Walt about Tonga

This “farm” was established by bringing in some “expert” from a fish store in the states and really making a mess. Just a bunch of broken off pieces of coral scattered around in the tanks so that they could be exempt from the coral quota the rest of us had to adhere to. After about a year they realized that they had a mountain of dead coral right outside their back door and started to take pictures of the damage. To make matters worse, this inexperienced “expert” went on the web (I think here) and started showing off horrifying pictures of himself walking all over the reef and holding up massive pieces of coral.


Not to name any names, but I seem to recall a particular LFS owner who had pictures similar to what is mentioned here. Same guy? Or another?

Also is Walt truly trying to be the good guy? Or just make himself sound like the good guy? Being as I really don't know him or his business.
 
Can I get a frag of PM Rich? Which one it it that you have?.....

I saw that on the .org forum this morning, and while I agree with his idea AFA making the transition into AC liverock, I'd imagine the guy has enough skrill to fund an AC venture. What's the worst that can happen? Write it off as a loss? And if the direct flights to and from Tonga get canceled, what's he gonna use a boat? Last time I looked at the world Tonga is an island pretty far away from any other ports, and airports.

He might be better off greasing the palms of our friendly neighbors to the south and avoiding shipping costs, and problems.

Oh well, it's another can-o-worms conversation, and I hope it doesn't wind up being a mud slinging contest, that is NOT what is needed right now if there is to be any reform.
 
[quote author=Roc link=topic=4168.msg49890#msg49890 date=1216942503]
whose Walt?
[/quote]Walt Smith, he looks like Dr. Quest from Johnny Quest.

Walt is a major player, and has been around forever, I have old TFH mags from the early '80s with his ads in there, Dr. Quest lookin and all.

waltsmith.com
 
[quote author=tuberider link=topic=4168.msg49891#msg49891 date=1216942765]
what's he gonna use a boat?
[/quote]

Hey tankers have ballasts that get filled with water, stick all the rocks there, they can stay live their entire trip! :D
 
[quote author=sfsuphysics link=topic=4168.msg49893#msg49893 date=1216943314]
[quote author=tuberider link=topic=4168.msg49891#msg49891 date=1216942765]
what's he gonna use a boat?
[/quote]

Hey tankers have ballasts that get filled with water, stick all the rocks there, they can stay live their entire trip! :D

[/quote]I hear you can get a deal on the Cosco Busan right now. Can you cook rock in a ballast, or are they just used to fire bulbs?
 
Thanks for the link. A very interesting read! There certainly seems to be a lot of the story untold, but if what Walt is saying is true, I'm quite impressed with his efforts. Isn't his company insulated from this change since they already have AC in full production? It seems he is trying to help out the other companies by trying to sway the government ban.
 
[quote author=mark_s link=topic=4168.msg49903#msg49903 date=1216946871]
Thanks for the link. A very interesting read! There certainly seems to be a lot of the story untold, but if what Walt is saying is true, I'm quite impressed with his efforts. Isn't his company insulated from this change since they already have AC in full production? It seems he is trying to help out the other companies by trying to sway the government ban.
[/quote]

Make sure you take anything like this with a bag of salt. They players all seem to skew things to make them look good.
I am not sure what his Fiji AC production has to do with Tonga, but it certainly would not insulate him because its two different countries.
Its interesting that this comes up this week because last week I was out of town giving a talk on what made the Tonga project that Walt mentions not work out.
 
Very interesting. I wonder how things are gonna pan out in Tonga. I always thought their corals were not so great and I don't care much for the live rock.

I would like to give Walt the benefit of the doubt and say that he's trying to do the right thing. There are people in the business who do it because they love it and not because they want money.
 
[quote author=Mr. Ugly link=topic=4168.msg49911#msg49911 date=1216952113]
Geez, so why don't you give us a talk/post here on what made the Tonga project not work?

:D
[/quote]book it! No way am I going to gel into any depth on writing!
 
Since we have Walt's comment on here, isn't it only fair to put the other side? If mods disagree, please remove.

Hello everyone. My name is Eddie Hanson and I'm an Indonesian coral exporter working out of Bali. Some of you may remember me back in the days when I used to have a reef shop called Tropical Paradise in the SF area. About 4 years ago, I had an opportunity to go to the Kingdom of Tonga to run a collection/export station.

One of the main problems that I saw right away was that the divers were never trained on the corals. They simply went out and collected what ever was around. On my first collecting trip, I threw back 90% of the corals. For sure most these corals would have ended up at some wholesaler or retailer unable to sell and eventually die. The guys were collecting corals that were not suitable for the aquarium trade. Of course these were experienced coral divers that had worked for other exporters before. The lead diver even worked for Walt Smith in Fiji. But in a matter of months, with me going out with them everyday for training, they started to catch on what is good and what is bad. So instead of taking 90% of corals around them that was not suitable, we were only taking 20%. More work but we were actually "less destructing the reef". I spent a lot of time with the divers and they all had nothing good to say about their former boss, Walt Smith. They used to tell me how they used to go to one area and wipe out all of the one species. I asked about some of the Indonesian corals, they said that Tonga used to have, but Walt took it all and there is no more. Walt Smith was one of the first exporter and collector, so there were really no regulations, so he simply did what he wanted. This is all coming from the divers, not other exporters or customers or anyone.

After I felt the divers can go collect on their own, it was time to work on fish. We had 5 divers total. We brought in 3 legal Filipino divers to train and work together with our Tongan divers on how to catch fish using nets. The trick was to teach our local divers, because eventually the Filipinos would go home after their contract. I took two of the more veterans of our diver crew and teamed them up with the Filipinos. At this time I teamed up with my friend who has a huge wholesale operation in northern California to bring in famous Steve Robinson to train our Filipino and Tonga divers how to catch fish without destructing the reefs. Robert (owner of Aquatic Specialties and Pets) and I wanted to make sure that any bad habits the Filipinos had, wasn't going to
be used in catching ornamental fish in Tonga. Steve is the expert in this field. Years ago, he was taught by Australians using nets and took his knowledge to PI. It was all cyanide back in those days and thanks to him, much of the fish collection is now net caught. Heck even my Filipino divers heard of Steve Robinson, just by reputation.

While this was going on, I also started an aquaculture project. Actually other companies were already doing it, just not so successful. We needed a place and ended up renting space from the Fisheries Clam Farm. Years ago, the Japanese had given this clam farm as a gift to Tonga. They trained the locals but after the Japanese left, things fell apart. The farm is a state of the art facility and had huge amount of potential. We dumped money and man power and cleaned up the place. We had a deal with the fisheries. We would pay rent and maintain the facility, although only half of the tanks were ours, and all the clams spawned we were going to share. So the fisheries loved me from the start. They had all to gain and nothing to loose. Daniel Knop even came out to consult. He went out with my divers and took a photo of the rare Tevora clam, which he really wanted for his next clam book. No one had an updated picture. He was very happy. I also had Anthony Calfo come out to help me with the aquaculture. I can grow corals in captive tanks but can I do it in the field? If I'm not sure, I get people that know to help me. The process was simple. We would get pieces from wild colonies and make broodstock. After these grow out, we would cut pieces and mount them on cement disks and grow these out for sale. But finding a place to grow the corals was more tricky than I thought. The first place was too shallow, the second place had too much sediment, the third place had too much algea and huge starfish that would eat the corals! Then finally I found a place where we could leave the corals alone for months at a time and grow nicely. I brought some samples to Macna at that time to see what kind of response I would get. People loved it. I even brought out my Tongan partner to the show so he can see what was happening on the otherside. The organizers were delighted that an exporter from overseas had come to the show. After the positive response of the aquaculture, we went back to Tonga to start production. We got permission from the fisheries to grow our corals in the certain area. No one was allowed to go there, but us. I had big plans to repopulate areas of damage left by Walt Smith.

Unfortunately, this is where I got screwed out of my Tonga operation and left. That was nearly around 3 years ago.

I'm now in Indonesia and have been here a year exporting super high quality corals. Actually my concept of aquaculture is even better than the concept that was developed here years ago. The "farmers" have to maintain and constantly clean the racks because of algea problems. My corals in Tonga needed no maintenance! I don't have an aquaculture license yet so I can't implement any of my ideas but once I do get it - watch out! I have a special project that will rock the industry!

So now I'm minding my own business in Indo, getting ready to leave for Vietnam in a day, and my friend Robert sends me a link to this thread. He says"you got to hear this crap!"

So here I am posting, and I haven't posted since the TP days when I used to sponsor.

So Mr. Smith,

What have I done to offend you so wrongly? I haven't been in Tonga for three years. I don't know what is going on? All I know, is that my aquaculture project went down the tubes and my partner no longer rents the fisheries clam farm. Everything is back to "normal".

I don't even know you. The only time we ever spoke was when you called me up from LA and asked me to sell fish to you exclusively. I brought in professional divers so we can export fish overseas, not to supply to my competitor. Where did you get the galls to ask me not to sell to anyone in LA? You should've just been glad that I was selling you corals and some leftover fish because your operation was dead at the time. All you were really sending was liverock. Actually we hardly ever sold rock. It was a loosing deal for us and we would only collect a few pieces when my customers requested it.

You neglected Tonga and focused all of your attention on Fiji. Heck you even lied to my friend a long time ago when we went to visit you at Pacific Aquafarms. There was this beautiful new rock that was displayed in one of your tanks. You called it Kaelini from Fiji! You never gave credit in the beginning for Tonga. So then I show up and start doing something good for everyone (we had at one point 28 employees. When I first got there, there were less than ten with part time divers), and you get upset 4 years later!

Now that you are loosing liverock quota, somehow it is my fault? How dare you bring me up in your problems! Where were you when I used to entertain all guests that used to come to the clam farm? The fisheries were proud that their clam farm was up an running. It used to be one of the "monkeys" on their backs. The government used to get on fisheries case about the condition of the farm. Now that I showed up, everyone was sending any people of importance my way. They were actually now proud. I used to have many meetings with my partner and the minister of the fisheries to talk about the future of the coral trade. I can tell you that there were very little guidelines even just a few years ago. Where were you?

Fellow reefers, for hobbyists Walt Smith is a hero. Because you guys don't know what goes on behind the scenes. I used to think he was the god of corals and had huge respect for him. Then I got into the business and found out the truth. I have heard the term "crowbar Walt" too many times on the field.

And oh by the way Walt, if you are such an expert on aquaculture, and I'm such an idiot, why was I asked to come to PNG to consult in an aquaculture project and not you?

Cheers Walt, we can talk man to man when we meet.

For everyone, I'm sorry for the extra long post. I apologize as I didn't plan on my first post on RC being so negative.

Cheers,
Eddie
 
thanks Mark - I am posting from my phone :D

I think both of those posts are filled with spin. Perhaps the other BAR member who was involved with the project will chime in.
 
[quote author=Thales link=topic=4168.msg50028#msg50028 date=1217024482]
I think both of those posts are filled with spin. Perhaps the other BAR member who was involved with the project will chime in.
[/quote]Yes, I think you are correct. It would be nice to hear the actual truth about Tonga, but its very unlikely that will happen.
All I'm interested in knowing is which AquaCulture operation I should or should not be supporting. We vote with our $$, so would be nice to know.
 
I dont entirely remember those pics but when I saw them, I dont remember anything that was glaringly wrong, so im hoping others could chime in. I do remember Eddie holding up a very big piece of millepora but I dont remember it exceeding any size limit. I also know others, including Walt, have accused Eddie of using a crowbar and again, I dont see what is wrong with this per se. A crowbar isnt necessary but I can see how it would make ones jobs easier. So again, I know Eddie has been criminalized for those pics but I dont remember seeing anything wrong.

Can others who remember chime in?
 
[quote author=mark_s link=topic=4168.msg50029#msg50029 date=1217025167]Yes, I think you are correct. It would be nice to hear the actual truth about Tonga, but its very unlikely that will happen.[/quote]

That's what I figure. Too much behind the scenes dirt. Not worth the effort to dig through all the BS to try to find out the real story. So many things in that industry are not what they seem. Too many people blowing smoke and acting out of self interest and self delusion.

Might be best to shut it all down and let DBTC supply the hobby.
 
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