Reef nutrition

Converting to bare bottom

kinetic

kinetic

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My sand is so brown. I haven’t found a tiger tail locally, and not sure the tank is even big enough for it anyway. I was thinking maybe starting my algae reactor back up with chaeto, but not sure if that would help.

so, maybe it’s time to suck all the sand out. What’s the best method? Just scoop with a cup and then try to suck the rest up with a siphon?
 
This is the crap I pulled out from my bare bottom tank on a weekly basis. I wonder how I got away in the last with sand bed and never clean the sand.

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ashburn2k said:
I use this to clean my sand and it does the wonder.

EHEIM Quick Vac Pro Automatic Gravel Cleaner and Sludge Extractor- PetOverstock https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003C5U2SU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_XBGGFCP4H21773C6NKNJ


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I have the same device, was planning to use it to clean out my sump a few years ago. In my hands it wasn’t good, just kicked most of the crap back into the water column. To me it seemed like the sieve wasn’t fine enough.

Edit: Seeing that it works for Hui maybe I’ll give it another try in my tank instead.
 
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kinetic said:
My sand is so brown. I haven’t found a tiger tail locally, and not sure the tank is even big enough for it anyway. I was thinking maybe starting my algae reactor back up with chaeto, but not sure if that would help.

so, maybe it’s time to suck all the sand out. What’s the best method? Just scoop with a cup and then try to suck the rest up with a siphon?
Click to expand...
For removing sand I’d recommend:

1. Clean it thoroughly first with a regular sand siphon cleaner or the device Hui mentioned above it works for you, because disturbing it is going to be messy.
2. Scoop out as much as you can.
3. Siphon the rest out with a regular 1/5” or so siphon tube running down to a filter sock in your sump, so that you can siphon for a while without wasting a lot of water.

I’m sure there are other good ways to do it. My main recommendation is to clean it thoroughly of detritus first.
 
Thanks all!
I’m going to see how much the gravel vac can clean the sand. It’s more that the grains have some algae making them brown. It’s not dino/cyano, so it’s been fine other than being ugly. If the vac somehow makes the sand white, then I’ll keep the sand. Otherwise I’ll start getting rid of it.
When I change water, I do stir up the sand quite a bit, just so it doesn’t settle too much so hopefully there’s not too much gunk or risk of a huge cycle.
My sand bed is only about 1-1.5” so it shouldn’t be too bad.
Any suggestions on a really good siphon and size? I have mostly Tropic Eden mesoflakes
 
I tried the Eheim, and while it pulls a little sludge, it's mostly just throwing cloudy junk back into the tank.

I ended up taking the tip off of my siphon tube for water changes, and that actually pulls out a massive amount of sludge from the sand.

I'm going to try to just keep pulling sludge out from the sand for a few weeks during water changes to see if this improves anything. I guess I'm wondering if all the junk in the sand is contributing to the algae growth on the sand itself.
 
You just need a good sand crew. Sand sifting stars, nassrisus snails, conchs. I've even tried introducing medusa worms and other sand dwelling creatures into my tank. Diversity is key. Pods and bristle worms help a lot too.
 
I tried that Eheim vacuum long ago. No luck. Fine dust went right through, and it clogged quickly.
I think it working or not depends a lot on the sand grain size.

I also tried cucumbers and a big cleanup crew. It worked a bit.
But then I had some cyano, which killed a fair amount of my cleanup crew, causing more of a mess.
Opinion: If you have a stable generally low nutrient tank, a big cleanup crew should work well. Otherwise, not so much.

But I eventually switched to bare bottom, and will never go back to sand.
 
I started my tank with bare bottom and with lots of flow. Nothing seems settling at the bottom for now, at least nothing I can see.
 
Vhuang168 said:
You just need a good sand crew. Sand sifting stars, nassrisus snails, conchs. I've even tried introducing medusa worms and other sand dwelling creatures into my tank. Diversity is key. Pods and bristle worms help a lot too.
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My nassarius all perished about 2 years after having the tank setup. I do have a handful of cerith snails for years, but they don't really do much. I've had the tonga fighting conches before, but they only last a few months it seems. I'm thinking about a tiger tail cucumber, but haven't found a small enough one for the tank.

I started with a pretty "sterile" tank, so maybe I just need a scoop of someone's sand or something... Any sources of stuff I can just buy from? I'm always worried about introducing nuisance things like hair algae/bubble algae etc.
 
kinetic said:
My nassarius all perished about 2 years after having the tank setup. I do have a handful of cerith snails for years, but they don't really do much. I've had the tonga fighting conches before, but they only last a few months it seems. I'm thinking about a tiger tail cucumber, but haven't found a small enough one for the tank.

I started with a pretty "sterile" tank, so maybe I just need a scoop of someone's sand or something... Any sources of stuff I can just buy from? I'm always worried about introducing nuisance things like hair algae/bubble algae etc.
Click to expand...

Check out ipsf.com for critters. I haven’t bought anything from them since I decided on bare bottom but heard good review.
 
kinetic said:
Any sources of stuff I can just buy from? I'm always worried about introducing nuisance things like hair algae/bubble algae etc.
Click to expand...
I don’t know too much about it but I’m going to pick some up when it’s available. The company that has started doing bacteria tests on reef tanks has some that they test to ensure it is pest free. They’re working to increase production but it sells out in a minute anytime they add some. You could join the waitlist, here’s a link for you to look into it for yourself. Seems like the safest option if you think your tank needs added diversity

Live Reef Rubble – AquaBiomics

aquabiomics.com
 
BRS has put out some interesting content across the past year or two.

They had a pretty lengthy discussion around Bare Bottom vs Sand.


The benefits of bare bottom are really obvious -- all the fish poop either directly floats into a skimmer/mechanical filtration, or it clumps up in a certain spot and makes clean up a breeze w/ water changes.

The down side, that doesn't really get mentioned, is that cycling your tank is long and painful unless you start with a bunch of live rock.

I know that was my personal experience. My tank got overrun with red turf algae, I pulled all the rock and threw it in an acid bath, effectively killing it.

Took out all my sand, and then the next year was a complete mess. Pretty much echoes what they discuss in that video. Tanks are easier to get started with sand. You can have successful tanks with or without sand. If your goal is low maintenance SPS dominant long term - then yea absolutely bare bottom is the easiest.

I personally went back to sand, and don't regret it. The tank felt like it lacked life -- I enjoy having the tiger conches, pistol + goby, sand dwelling wrasses.

Heck BRS just did another video on the topic:

Its pretty interesting -- they straight out say they would never do barebottom + dry rock for a new tank ever again.
 
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